The reduced time between detection and engagement, driven by real-time drone surveillance and the high velocity of FPV attack drones, has created a hostile environment for traditional armored platforms on the battlefield.

This battlefield approach is likely to become a lasting part of Russian military practice, making it relevant for those preparing to counter Russian aggression

All credits to Tatarigami_UA and Frontelligence Insight team

Thread with key findings here: https://xcancel.com/Tatarigami_UA/status/1937204380740256083

  • jasory@programming.dev
    0·
    6 days ago

    Why don’t they have any APCs? What was causing them to lose them at such a high rate? Surely if they produce more of them, they won’t lose them again to the exact same battlefield tactics.

    You complain about propaganda, yet the way you seem to avoid repeating the “propaganda”, is to regress to completely ignoring why APCs weren’t protecting troops anyway.

    The reality is that in Ukraine, the drone and artillery concentration is such that armored vehicles aren’t effective. What is effective is having small agile units that can advance before the enemy can direct fire at them.

    • supersquirrel@sopuli.xyz
      0·
      6 days ago

      Why don’t they have any APCs? What was causing them to lose them at such a high rate? Surely if they produce more of them, they won’t lose them again to the exact same battlefield tactics.

      Because they have resorted to throwing large numbers of armored vehicles at a foe that has innovated with new technology far better and has large amounts of foreign military help especially along intelligence and target acquisition tactics.

      The reality is that in Ukraine, the drone and artillery concentration is such that armored vehicles aren’t effective. What is effective is having small agile units that can advance before the enemy can direct fire at them.

      This could not be further from the truth, I can link plenty of sources to this but no armored vehicles are just as important as they ever have been and you are falling prey to shallow popular mechanics style future war hype pieces if you think that drones and artillery make armor obsolete.

      To point out something basic, the reason Ukraine hasn’t been able to make decisive use of the 30 or so abrams and 30 or so leopards main battle tanks they were given (which is actually quite an intimidating number of tanks given that these tanks eat Russian tanks for breakfast, well actually usually for a midnight snack…) is that Ukraine hasn’t until recently had the necessary artillery to support an armored assault outside the context of decisive air power (which Ukraine also doesn’t have).

      The thing people often don’t realize about main battle tanks is they are much more vulnerable to infantry than one would assume, even when the infantry opposing the tank don’t have the means to directly destroy the tank. Tanks must either

      1. be heavily screened with infantry and other assets to help them not miss a hidden enemy with anti-tank capability or some kind of physical tank trap/hole designed to strand the tank crew in openground vulnerable to artillery

      Or…

      1. this is the most critical thing! Main battle tanks are best used to create a breach through heavily entrenched enemy lines, but a crucial element of this push must be a very closely coordinated, absolutely oppressive rolling artillery barrage that advances along the front and corridors of an armored heavy assault. This rolling barrage of artillery changes the caluculus as not being in a trench or an armored vehicle becomes a stochastic risk from shrapnel flying out of the air and ending your life.

      Tanks can move through this kind of intense breach opened at the absolute most high intensity conflict areas in a land war and survive the hellish conditions which might include very close by artillery support to repel counterattacks.

      • jasory@programming.dev
        0·
        6 days ago

        So your response is to make an irrelevant and sophomoric monologue?

        You acknowledge yourself that the ideal tactics don’t actually work in Ukraine. And yet you never ask yourself why, and how you are supposed to mitigate the countermeasures.

        Also, try not to accuse others of falling to a notion, when they give zero evidence for you to claim clairvoyance. Notice that I didn’t accuse you of falling for the “meat wave” notion, even though you were almost certainly alluding to it.

        • supersquirrel@sopuli.xyz
          0·
          6 days ago

          You really think that because you understand math and programming that magically makes you understand war don’t you?

          sigh the thing is this is basic stuff with armored/mechanized warfare, it isn’t new, so you obviously really really REALLY don’t know what you are talking about and as smart as you are you undermine and weaponize all that intelligence by being so confidently wrong and unable to listen.

          Perfect example of how computer nerds can be absolutely insufferable with their assumed intellectual superiority on domains they are completely talking out of their asses on and just assume work the same as programming or math.

          https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=XJE76Lt4g7E

          https://en.defence-ua.com/industries/ukrainian_armor_llc_is_ready_to_mass_produce_varta_2_apc_integrated_with_sich_30mm_gun_turret-14598.html

          The long-awaited combat vehicle entering serial production opens new opportunities to acquire vital armor for the Ukrainian Armed Forces and find export success globally Ukrainian Armor LLC has officially announced the completion of testing and codification procedures for its new Varta-2 wheeled armored vehicle, which has now received clearance for delivery to the Defense Forces of Ukraine.

          This milestone marks the beginning of serial production of a combat platform that frontline soldiers have repeatedly requested, according to the company’s press service.

          https://english.nv.ua/russian-war/ukraine-s-international-legion-hails-bradley-s-resilience-in-saving-lives-50484889.html

          M113s have become indispensable for Ukraine’s armed forces. These vehicles not only help stop Russian advances with their advanced weaponry but also save the lives of countless Ukrainian soldiers. For Paradox and his comrades, the Bradley is more than just a vehicle—it’s a trusted member of their team, one that consistently proves its worth in the face of relentless danger.

          “Our determination to rescue it wasn’t just about saving a piece of equipment,” Paradox explained. “The M113 saves lives every day. It’s a symbol of survival and victory.”

          https://armyrecognition.com/news/army-news/2025/breaking-news-france-to-continue-military-aid-to-ukraine-with-phase-out-of-army-combat-vehicles-and-missiles

          It was a highly unusual package at that moment. There were 60 boats, 400 vehicles, and 1,600 missiles. The boats and missiles I understood then, but only now am I able to grasp the importance of 400 vehicles. Britain set the ball rolling. Since they released the aid package before the United States did, I think it nudged the United States to include a decent amount of Bradley Infantry Fighting Vehicles and M113 Armored Personnel Carriers. Now, Sweden is sending 650 vehicles.

          To help with mobility, France has sent 38 AMX-10 RCR armored vehicles, and approximately 260 VABs armored personnel carriers. These vehicles have been crucial in allowing Ukrainian forces to remain mobile and protected on the battlefield. Additionally, Ukraine has received a range of logistical support in the form of Renault TRM 2000 trucks, Renault TRM 10000 fuel trucks, and Peugeot P4 off-road vehicles, which were partially funded by crowdfunding efforts from the Ukrainian public.

          https://shankar20.medium.com/why-the-allies-are-pouring-ifvs-and-apcs-into-ukraine-91f68dcfc5c6

          Estimates vary, but it is reasonable to assume the Russians have around half a million troops in Ukraine. As Russian Defense Minister Belosov and President Putin warily watch their Soviet-era tanks, infantry fighting vehicles, and armored personnel carriers deplete at an alarming rate, there is only one recourse they have: pile up the infantry.

          They are already doing that, and they are going to do it even more.

          …

          They cannot repeat the same mistake the Russians have made by asking their soldiers to find their way to the frontline. Ukraine needs a significant number of infantry fighting vehicles (IFVs) and armored personnel carriers (APCs). They need these vehicles now and a steady flow of them in the future. Ukraine requires a highly mobile army that can move in and out of the frontline at an alarming speed.

          Would you like to discuss another topic you assume you understand without having even learned the basics of yet?

          • jasory@programming.dev
            0·
            5 days ago

            Would you like to practice clairvoyance some more? You have gone on two unhinged tangents speculating on claims I’ve never made

            You concede that your commentary is highly trivial, and yet you keep talking.

            This is truly sad and pathetic, and at this point I suspect that you are actually mentally ill. No normal person responds like this, let alone to a claim that they imagined.