Summary
Ontario will impose a 25% surcharge on electricity exports to New York, Michigan, and Minnesota starting Monday in retaliation for Trump’s tariffs on Canadian goods.
Premier Doug Ford warned U.S. governors and vowed to maintain the surcharge until all tariffs are lifted.
Canada has already imposed $30 billion in retaliatory tariffs, with more planned.
Ford also threatened to cut power to the states by April and banned U.S. firms from bidding on Ontario contracts. A $100M SpaceX deal for rural internet was also scrapped in response.
Just do it please
As an American- Agree. The dumbfucks in this country aren’t going to understand they fucked up, until the pain kicks in.
Except 2/3 of those states voted blue.
It sucks, but that’s where we are at. It’s not like the majority of the Dems are doing anything to actually fight back against this. If blue states get hit too, it might actually get them moving.
Fair point. I just wish they hit more red states.
Same, man. I just wish we weren’t going through any of it, but we have too many emotionally and mentally stunted people over here that have us in this situation in the first place.
Plenty of red outside the cities, though, and if they figure out why they’re suddenly paying more for electricity, it may change a few minds about Republicans.
Of course, they’re more likely to just blame Democrats for it, but one can hope.
Any foreigner should avoid visiting US or buying US products to put pressure too.
It is crazy to advocate for it, as I live in US, but this administration needs pressure from everywhere.
Brit here, I make sure to try and pay more attention and avoid American products now. Not that I bought many before, cola is probably the main one when at a pub/restaurant. Now if there is nothing else I want I just get water. So probably a healthier switch.
Pretty sure american products don’t have much of a presence outside of the USA because they’re actually low-quality and expensive.
Is that so? In my experience (obviously it depends on the company) American made is, like, one of the gold standards? I’ve never had issue with American made things 🤷♀️
Again, I’m sure it depends on the product, and I may just have bias because I meticulously research just about everything before I buy, so I may just be buying the really good US made stuff, and most other things are crap, idk. Just like Germany and Japan have things that they really excel in; Australia too, etc.
Take cars, for example. Americans don’t export their cars on the same level as Japan or even South Korea because their cars are shit.
I have a friend who used to sell rental car insurance and he’d tell me that it’s the American cars that always break down.
I’m American and looking around my room, the vast majority of products are coming from other nations. My bass guitar. My speakers. My controllers. My laptop. My mouse. My headphones. Etc etc.
Buying AmericanTM is just propaganda for useful idiots. I guarantee you most people who are afraid of foreign products or tout American-made quality are simply talking from a lack of experience. They’re afraid of what they don’t know and don’t want to have an experience that might show them they’re wrong.
I mean, I did say that it depends on the product. And based on the things you listed, maybe you’re not the demographic that seeks out the quality items that the US does make? Like hiking boots, for instance: several companies based in the US make incredible boots. Textiles in general as well: usually when a garment is made in the US, it’s a really good quality item.
I also have a good set of screwdrivers made in the US that I use often to restore sewing machines. Cutlery and dishes as well.
These are things just off the top of my head 🤷♀️
US made things that are the best or in a small group of the best:
Hand tools, power tools, machine tools, alloys, plastics, clothing/footwear, hardware, firearms, whiskey, porn, movies/shows, glass/ceramics, camping/outdoor, and all sorts of luxury items.
Affordability is a different issue. There are usually options that are good enough and cheaper.
When Trump said “America is back!” did he mean in the back of the line? Cause that’s where we’re at fellas.
In healthcare, we’ve been back of the line for decades.
Glad Canada is sticking to I because they’re sending a message Trump that they’re not going to fuck around with him flipping the on/off switch on tariffs
I think the damage is done. I hope to never see American liquor in stores ever again.
I’m American I agree. Your country doesn’t deserve our businesses if we have a dictator running our country
We will be happy to come back as soon as America enacts stronger protections to prevent this from happening again and dumps Trump. Nothing wrong the the American people, it’s just one American and one south African than are ruining everything for everyone.
There’s definitely a lot wrong with a large portion of the American people.
Unfortunately, the dumbest ~70 million Americans got together and ruined it for everyone.
Trump is just one guy, but he’s the fart filled turd floating on top of a long stream of raw sewage.
What kind of protections though he is in violation of
NAFTA2erm… USMCA that he negotiated himself. Technically what he is doing is illegal, but Republican Congress is letting him do it.You’re forgetting about the 70 million folks who voted for him. Terrible hateful folks
Add that to the eleigble voters who abstained and you have a sizable proportion of the adult population.
Exactly – the threat of tariffs – and annexation! – must not only stop, but be refuted forever by a new treaty, signed by the US. Promising both will stop, for good, is the only remedy now.
The era of US-Canada being brothers in arms is over. I doubt US will be receiving any favors in the future without something in return. And if Canada chooses to expand their supply chains outside of the US, which they 100% should, there’ll be no coming back to a scale of trade as it exists today.
I cut off a Canadian guy I was friends with recently, this guy agreed with everything Trump was doing.
Told him I don’t associate with Trump supporters, even weirder you’re Canadian.
He said he didn’t support trump, but reads all the policies front to back and agrees with them.
I said ok, bye and blocked his ass.
Wtf is going on?? He had some bullshit reply to everything like he was Canadian maga.
It basically boils down to this: Trump is a lying, racist, rapist.
How do you put trust in anything he says? I can show you 200 lies, with evidence, just in the last week. He loves Putin and himself, gives no shits about us. He’s already broken long existing agreements with other countries, he CANNOT be trusted, no matter how good what he says sounds. His goal is to exact revenge on those that don’t like him or have said something bad about him, his skin is so thin. You don’t “accidentally” rape a person, he is an absolute terrible human being who deserves zero respect from anyone. Fuck Trump in the neck with a metal pipe.
They’re the Austrian who likes Hitler.
Reich wing populism is on the rise, globally.
So, he might hate Trump, but he love the Canadian version.
The same forces that created Trump are at work in Canada. And they are supported by US organizations. Have you noticed that suddenly even second tier US politicians have opinions about Trudeau, Carney, and Pollievre? It is the same as Musk in Germany. We are under attack.
John Stewart agrees with some of the DOGE objectives.
John Oliver agrees with some of RFKs beliefs.
Even a broken clock is right twice a day. But believing these thieves at face value is dumb. RFK plays into whatever grift gets him more attention and money.
Everyone feels that the government can be more efficient, but literally firing 100k employees without even knowing what they do and then having to try and get them back due to the massive fuckup? And the childish emails they’re sending employees? All within 30 days?? This is amateur hour man, you have to start to think what is their game, how are they benefiting. Crashing the economy so they can buy up more property cheap like in 2018 and COVID years? There is a game plan and we’re not even being thought about, were just fucked
That’s a problem we have globally. Although it might seem like Trump style populism vs Canadian neo-liberalism(with all it’s pros and cons), we’re both purple. You guys just have a bit more right wing red in the dye mix. It’s plausible that Canada elects our own Trump then we can both be stupid.
The only ideology that has a chance at stopping the populist wave is Sanders style social democracy because it addresses the same core issue of wealth disparity. But it doesn’t look like anyone is electing that anytime soon.
Trump doesn’t want Canada as a friend. They will just try and stop him from deals with Russia.
There is no greater enemy than a friend betrayed
You can replace Canada with any other country! Europe and the US aren’t really friends anymore these days.
This read as downplaying Canada’s significance for a moment, and then immediately circled back to the US being the isolationist Pariah state it is becoming
I just hope everyone is learning how easily your country can be owned and controlled by outside interest - if your country is filled with uneducated, incurious, and indoctrinated citizens. We have no one to blame but ourselves as we ask The Kremlin to take the wheel.
Canada - America trade amounts to a little over $920B https://crsreports.congress.gov/product/pdf/IF/IF12595
Canadian GDP is a little over $2.1T https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/NY.GDP.MKTP.CD?locations=CA
We’re talking nearly half of their GDP. In addition, half of Canadian foreign investment comes directly from the US. They will continue to be integrated into the US economy, even if Trump doubled the tariffs tomorrow.
And that’s because Canada, and Mexico to an even higher extent, are completely reliant on US trade. They both have no real choice but to grin and bear it. They will of course speak out publicly for the domestic audience but things will continue more or less status quo for the foreseeable future.
canada and Mexico are not “grinning and bearing it” though
Yes, they are. There will be no meaningful response because they have no leverage. Any meaningful change from status quo would mean an immediate economic crisis.
Ignore what they say on camera because they are speaking to their domestic audience.
Right now, Canada has placed a 25% tariff on $30B worth of imports. That’s 7% of US imports. Whereas Trump has placed 25% on everything that Canada exports to the US.
And 80% of Canadian exports go directly to the US.
So just for reference.
Canada retaliatory tariff -> $30B which represents less than 1% of total US exports
Trump’s tariffs -> ~$550B which represents nearly 80% of total Canadian exports
Ignore the rhetoric, look at the numbers. Canada and Mexico have no choice. They signed their economic autonomy away a long time ago. It’s sort of like when Greece went through their debt crisis and couldn’t do jack shit because they signed away their autonomy to Brussels (and really Germany).
There are trade-offs to every decision. Canada got easy access to the American market and a nice way to exploit their natural resources. But it also gives Washington an absurd amount of leverage over them.
Mexico is even more screwed.
I’m not disagreeing with you that free trade with the US was a very stupid thing for Canada to agree to, but back in the day it was shoved down our throats by the conservative government of the day. Canada is experiencing the consequences of that poor decision right now. That being said, as an export heavy, raw materials-heavy country we have a lot of options. In the first Trunp presidency we signed CETA with the EU, we already get a lot of food imports from Mexico (that won’t change) and since Donald was elected the 2nd time we’ve signed trade deals with Ecuador, and new military agreements with Brazil and the Philippines on top of all our existing allies. There will be more deals that Canada makes, unlike the US, our signature on international agreements actually means something. Canadians aren’t at all like Americans, we are united and we will do anything and everything it takes to protect our sovereignty and our country. Again unlike Americans, we are prepared to go without. We’re a smaller economy and therefore more nimble. We’re doing all kinds of things internally as well. Barring military action by the US on us, I am not that worried and have full confidence in all Canadians to stand up for ourselves and do what we need to do to rid ourselves of the US fascist protectionist isolationist scourge.
All countries are sovereign but some countries are more sovereign than others. If Canada’s priority was protecting sovereignty then they would not be in this position to begin with.
It’s something that has been decades in the making. It will take decades to reverse course. It isn’t going to meaningfully change in the upcoming 5-10 years.
You say Canadians are ready to “go without” but we’re talking about millions of people losing their jobs. A historic spike in poverty. Collapse of many industries. No sane leadership would ever cut off trade with America. National pride doesn’t feed a family.
Long term, sure, maybe there will be a realignment. I doubt it, but it’s possible. The near future is a chaotic one where Canada and Mexico are going to need the economic value from America. We’re headed for troubled times globally.
No offense but Trump would welcome these on highly liberal Minnesota and New York and be impartial to Michigan. These are not affecting conservative states.
It will affect the customers, who are rural. The states are blue, because of their cities, but the cities aren’t reliant on Canadian electricity. The rural areas are, and they vote red.
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Yes. Unfortunately, it’s a very blunt instrument. The rest of our tariffs have been ultra-targeted, but Doug Ford really wants to do something and this is the main tool he has provincially.
There’s enough rural, conservative areas within those states that would be affected I imagine Trump will have some blowback. How much is hard to say at this point, especially given that he’s still adding and removing his own tariffs all the time.
And Trump cares that these blue states will be cut off why?
Maybe a state like NY votes blue in state wide elections, but they vote in a lot of Republicans for the House in districts outside if NYC
Michigan is a blue state?
No, but the other two are, and New York in particular is a very notable blue state.
I’m ok with this and live in one of the affected states.
I’m certain he’s doing it for the wrong reasons, but it’s nice to see the angry raging conservative attacking a genuine asshole for once.
Honestly he’s even doing it for the right reasons. His country has been economically attacked. Not to respond would just make it worse.
I suspect he’s playing it up for the camera in order to differentiate himself from American conservatives now that they’ve begun turning on Canada. It’s something I imagine we’ll see out of Poilievre as well, because otherwise they’ll quickly become unelectable.
Just remember that they were chums all up until this point, and that’s still damning. Ford supported American conservatives all the way until the leopards turned to eat his face. Yeah, it’s cool that he’s going above and beyond to fight back now, but he still wants Ontario to act like Texas.
Not disagreeing at all. It’s the standard right wing mode of operation, nothing matters until it affects them personally. It should be studied as a developmental disability.
I’m not so sure about Poilievre. Imo he’ll take a more moderate stance against MAGA if any at all. He’s changed his stance recently, similar to Ford, but it felt a bit later and a bit weaker.
Yeah Ford is a raging asshole so he’s loud and combative. PP genuinely just seems like a little bitch puppet so even if he turns on MAGA, I don’t think it will be as loud as this.
Can they get the Fed to drop the F35 contract for a European platform?
Do what you have to do it’s all good. I’m going to be part of the brain drain in this country. My wife and I are POC we are guaranteed first class tickets to death camps or be made slaves for existing. Our populations have been marginalized and kicked in the ribs for centuries. We have no reason to fight or to ‘stay and fix the country’ any more than the German Jews of last century did. I don’t want to be made responsible for what racist whites have enabled to happen in this country.
I’ve got quite the resume and I’ve been having trouble finding sponsors overseas. I would love to be a part of the brain drain.
I’m about to get my Mexican permanent residency 🥳
Why are mostly blue states getting punished for shithead? They should be focusing on red states. They’re the ones who voted for this nonsense.
USA is USA.
People outside of the USA will treat you the same as you treat any other nation. Does trumps tariffs only target the liberal provinces?
Canada can’t exactly cut off power to Texas
Texas handles their own outages perfectly well.
Because, it turns out, that blue states and red states are part of the same country. I think it’s a stupid way to do things, but that’s what you guys have settled on.
I don’t know all the facts but maybe if more people.votrd in the first place Donald wouldn’t have won? Maybe not… But Americans should be pushing back and they haven’t done anything yet but complain online. Pushing any single one of them to take action is better than only attempting to punish the ones who don’t even care.
I wonder if ON can impose a 25% surcharge solely on Michigan? Ultimately, it doesn’t really matter. Plenty of people from Minnesota (47%) and New York (43 %) voted for this nonsense.
Eh, upstate NY is probably all red, save for perhaps part of Albany. NY State and NY City are very, very different.
Hold up - if there is already a 25% tariff - IE tax - on Canadian electricity, does that mean that there is now another 25% tax on that electricity?
And wouldn’t this have a slight compounding effect on the second us tariff?
Yes, but us postponed their tariffs another month.
Thing that sucks tho, is at this point it doesn’t matter if there’s tariffs or not, since people have started preparing as if there will be. Worse, tariffs get integrated into an economy and are next to impossible to un-do. God 45 is so stupid
I like it, but I’m a little confused.
Why does an individual province determine trade policy? Is this normal for Canada?
The deal is between the provincial utility, which provides the electricity, and the state utility. In the USA, the federal government controls most resource rights. In Canada, it’s the provinces. Comparatively, provinces are a lot more powerful than states are. As I understand it.
Yes, and we even have a lot of interprovincial trade issues. Although with what is happening with the US, we are trying to simply cross provincial trading.
Afaik Quebec is also able to block things like oil pipelines and stuff
Since Trump wants to complain about the trade deficit, Canada should cap exports to be equal to imports from the US. Poof no more trade deficit.
Just cut off the oil, that would do it.
Alberta makes all their money off oil, most pipelines dip down into the US because Native groups have a fit whenever pipelines attempt to cross certain provinces. Michigan has the same fit about those pipelines, but that’s mostly because ships dropping anchor over the pipelines and the ecological disaster that would occur makes them uneasy. Everyone wants oil, but until the world turns into Minecraft and we learn to send liquids wirelessly, someone’s fucked.
Kudos to the Canadians and Canadiens! I ordered another pair of Baffin boots, Made in Canada, last week.
