An open source project the size of Lemmy needs constant work to manage the project, implement new features and fix bugs. Dessalines and I work full-time on these tasks and more. As there is no advertising or tracking, all of our work is funded through donations. Unfortunately the amount of donations has decreased to only 2000€ per month. This leaves only 1000€ per developer, which is not enough to pay my bills. With the current level of donations I will be forced to find another job, and drastically reduce my contributions to Lemmy. To avoid this outcome and keep Lemmy growing, I ask you to please make a recurring donation:
Liberapay | Ko-fi | Patreon | OpenCollective | Crypto
If you want more information before donating, consider the comparison with Reddit. It began as startup funded by rich investors. The site is managed by corporate executives who over time have become more and more disconnected from normal users. Their main goal is to make investors happy and to make a profit. This leads to user-hostile decisions like firing the employee responsible for AMAs, blocking third-party apps and more. As Reddit is a single website under a single authority, it means all users need to follow the same rules, including ridiculous ones like censoring the name “Luigi”.
Lemmy represents a new type of social media which is the complete opposite of Reddit. It is split across many different websites, each with its own rules, and managed by normal people who actually care about the users. There is no company and no profit motive. Much of the work is carried out by volunteer admins, mods and posters, who contribute out of enthusiasm and not for money. For users this is great as there is no advertising nor tracking, and no chance of takeover by a billionaire. Additionally there are no builtin political or ideological restrictions. You can use the software for any purpose you like, add your own restrictions or scrutinize its inner workings. Lemmy truly belongs to everyone.
Dessalines and I work fulltime on Lemmy to keep up with all the feature requests, bug reports and development work. Even so there is barely enough time in the day, and no time for a second job. Previously I sometimes had to rely on my personal savings to keep developing Lemmy for you, but that can’t go on forever. We partly rely on NLnet for funding, but they only pay for development of new features, and not for mandatory maintenance work. The only available option are user donations. To keep it viable donations need to reach a minimum of 5000€ per month, resulting in a modest salary of 2500€ per developer. If that goal is reached Dessalines and I can stop worrying about money, and fully focus on improving the software for the benefit of all users and instances. Please use the link below to see current donation stats and make your contribution! We especially rely on recurring donations to secure the long-term development and make Lemmy the best it can be.
Update: For those of you who want to support Lemmy development without financing the hosting of lemmy.ml, know that the hosting is paid exclusively through OpenCollective. You can see the payment details at this link. This means donations through all other platforms (Liberapay, Ko-fi, Patreon, Crypto) are exclusively for Lemmy development, and not a single cent goes to lemmy.ml hosting.
This should probably be documented on the open collective page.
Right, updated.
But I want to support lemmy.ml
Then you can donate via Opencollective. But honestly it doesnt matter, because lemmy.ml hosting is already covered, and is very cheap compared to developer salaries.
I appreciate the transparency! :)
Who are the developers and what instance are they affiliated with?
Nutomic and Dessalines, and lemmy.ml
From the post
Dessalines and I work fulltime on Lemmy to keep up with all the feature requests, bug reports and development work.
So @[email protected] and @[email protected] are the developers
You can see from their usernames, they are primarily associated with lemmy.ml, which they are the admins of
As far as I understand it, the development team of Lemmy is bigger than that, but nutomic and dessalines as the founders and paid to develop lemmy full-time of course are the most important ones.
@[email protected] is a maintainer of lemmy I think and
@[email protected] is a maintainer of lemmy backend?
Not sure about the status of flamingos and phiresky who also contribute to the codebase and were part of the recent AMA
Flamingos is a much loved admin of feddit.uk ☺️
What if I’m so propagandized by American technofascist social media that I am incapable of believing Marxists would be able to make and maintain a project of this size? How do I donate to the real devs? (/j)
Real question: assuming I’m basically broke, which is more helpful to y’all: a yearly dono of $100 or a weekly pledge of $2?
I advise you to consider the weekly pledge over the one time donation. It would be a better course of action as it might help them plan ahead.
Also, I’m a caveman, so I would advise against following my advice
The real devs are locked into a server room with appropriate supplies of food and caffeine. So dont worry about them.
Yearly or weekly doesnt make a big difference so whatever works for you. Depending on the platform small donations may have higher fees though.
This update is what made me setup a recurring donation.
Thanks :)
Donated on Liberapay.
As others have said, this is financing software development, not a political campaign. I first learned of the fediverse when Reddit removed 3rd party apps, and I felt like my eyes were opened. This is what I want the internet to be, decentralized and running on open source software, and I’m sure I’m far from being alone in this, so thanks to the devs for that.
Also Jerboa is great!
Jerboa is the best, it’s how I browse Lemmy exclusively.
Why do LGTBQ+xyz10 always have to make a fuss about everything… It reminds me of the vegan fuss era.
You still use lemmy’s backend and have a safe frontend space to stay. That’s kinda hypocrite to use a service that is “anti-lgtb” and still make a fuss about it. If lemmy really was about racial or sexual discrimination you would already know it.
It also reminds me all the fuss about THEIR safe game space only THEM are allowed to use… Uuhhhg it’s kinda getting out of hand !
What ever, my point is, if you want to keep Lemmy alive, help out and donate to the creators. If you’re a just a dumb leech, use a service that somehow “discriminates” you, don’t donate, but PLEASE ! Leave.
It’s LGBTQ, Lesbian Gay Bisexual Trans and Queer. Atleast pretend to be literate while you demean us and our hard fought victories to simply be able to live with dignity and respect that all people are due.
Yeah :) Just don’t forget to add all the other groups (+) !
That’s so original I bet no queer person has ever heard that one before
Oh yeah, vegans were so fussy with their demands that you
Checks notes
Stop eating the dead flesh of abused animals that are bred in horrific death factories.
I always found carnists more obnoxious than vegans. Anytime you see a vegan offered a meat product and they politely turn it down like “oh no thanks” some idiot is always like “👁️👄👁️ ArE YoU VeGaN? I LikE BaCoN! HaHa I’M GoInG To EaT An ExTrA BuRgEr NoW To AnNoY YoU! MMM!” Like fuck off and let them eat their tofu, you dick.
You even get sick fucks slipping vegans meat and then laughing about it to them later like “HAHAHA I MADE YOU EAT MEAT!” cool bro, how would you feel if I made you eat your dog, you sociopath.
If you sincerely can’t keep track of an acronym like LGBTQIA2S, I totally understand. I find it helpful to use people with minority “Sexual Orientations and Gender Identites” (SOGI). You could say
people with minority SOGIs
Or
SOGI minorities
Or
SOGIm
It’s not a super widespread abbreviation, so I’d recommend spelling it initially as I did in my first paragraph. I don’t think it’s best practice to say “SOGIs” Because everyone has a SOGI and typically we’re trying to talk specifically about those that face(d) disenfranchisement and bigoted violence.
If you’re not sincerely struggling with the acronym, and enjoy trivializing people for fun, I hope you think of me everything you stub your toe.
Why do LGTBQ+xyz10 always have to make a fuss about everything…
Because the group (collectively) have a history of being systematically killed and lynched for their sexuality, not to mention the rest of the suppression and oppression. So politics and attacks are taken seriously.
It also reminds me all the fuss about THEIR safe game space only THEM are allowed to use…
It’s pretty reasonable to create a community where they feel comfortable and kick out all the unconstructive trolling and arguments that people can find in a million other places. Lemmy.ml kicks out racists and other reactionary wastes, so you’re in a comparable safe space right now. Do you enjoy the lack of Nazi scum and rabid anti-socialist trolls? I do!
What ever, my point is, if you want to keep Lemmy alive, help out and donate to the creators.
Many of those comrades have already done this, judging by their comments on various instances.
Just gauging the sentiment towards lemmy.ml, even in the fediverse there needs to be a safe space for people. It’s sad to say, but merely jumping ship from reddit doesn’t ensure that comrades will be safe online. .world and .ee users seem to be reddit-esque but just in a different ilk. I regularly see users from those communities targeting .ml users and since the reddit exodus it’s only gotten worse. Stay strong comrades.
It’s sad to say, but merely jumping ship from reddit doesn’t ensure that comrades will be safe online. .world and .ee users seem to be reddit-esque but just in a different ilk.
It’s no secret that most people on Lemmy came from reddit at some point, and people left reddit for different reasons. The first big waves of users were from piracy subreddits, /r/GenZedong’s quarantine (went to Lemmygrad, which became the biggest federated instance at the time) and /r/ChapoTrapHouse (succeeded by Hexbear, the largest instance at the time). So because these groups were large, whole and somewhat outliers to reddit overall, there was only some broader reddit culture carried across.
The next big waves were with the API fiasco and Luigi censorship, which largely went to general-purpose instances like .world and .ee for various reasons. Their move was most likely about disdain with the admins’ choices or being forced off the platform, not any opposition to reddit culture in general, so the shift toward reddit-esque community was immediately clear. And while Lemmy has a few design decisions that materially disincentive things like karma-farming, it will take a while, and most likely effort, if we want to counter or improve that culture.
Yeah, makes sense. I was part of the reddit exodus with the api stuff. Although, I’m not someone that would be part of the typical reddit culture. Or at least the die-hard libs types. I always was on the fringes of reddit, and in the last few years I stayed away more often than not. There are a few forums and “smol web” places I visit. Even frequent irc occasionally. So, I’ve been out of the loop when it comes to the general reddit mentality. It sucks that those types have to take the piss out of .ml users so frequently though, it’s gotten pretty annoying lately with people saying stuff like “of course, it’s a .ml user” like we’re some type of pariahs.
Because the group (collectively) have a history of being systematically killed and lynched for their sexuality, not to mention the rest of the suppression and oppression. So politics and attacks are taken seriously.
I get that… And that’s a very serious issue and concern for whatever group you’re defending ! But com’on we are on lemmy here, not on some obscure, harsh dictatorship killing people. Some of the admin may have said something inappropriate (that’s arguable…) But that doesn’t take away that we all can thrive here as a community, what ever your color, sexual orientation, religion…
Without the lemmy devs and others, there wouldn’t even be any Lemmy at ALL. Seeing how it goes, this is going to ruine everything for everyone…
Lemmy’s backend allows to create every safe space and community you want and people will still go one and argue against a personal opinion that didn’t killed a fly…
What ever. This kind of mentality is going to ruin the fun for everyone…
Go Vegan :)
maybe give incentives like upvote award feature for the respective instance that has been donated to. that way people would be more willing to get something out of it in a more tangible way
That might affect whether or not the income is taxable.
What do you mean by “upvote award feature”?
awards that cosmetically work like upvotes in a sense. reddit has them, but they link that to nothing or ad free features.
Bound to donations I dont see why this would be a bad idea. Gives a strong sense of community, especially if theres for example special ones bound to each instance
I see, or simpler yet a special badge which is shown next to donor’s username. Definitely worth considering. Thanks for the suggestion!
may I use this moment to ask you if this is intended (see spoiler formatted section in the post)
EDIT maybe its the photon frontend, I’ll crosspost there too
awards that cosmetically work like upvotes in a sense.
Upvotes are mechanical, maybe there’s a better comparison. I left reddit before they added awards, but I assume the idea is that someone donates and is then able to add a decorative award to their favorite posts they see, maybe limited to giving one award per day?
It’s fun, but on the other hand when I occasionally visit reddit, some posts look like a slot machine with a hundred awards, and even if they don’t mechanically push a post higher, it feels a bit pay-to-win for me, because someone with lots of money can put attention-grabbing awards on posts they like. So I’m not sure where I sit on on those kinds of features, because I do believe that it’s helpful to reward people who have donated, so long as they don’t get an advantage in the community for it.
well it would be tied to financing this platform in my suggestion, so I dont see the issue if the upvotes are the only metric for post ranking and on the other hand awards being only cosmetic
u can always ublock them away if you personally have spite against the look of some icon. but yea there surely is a wrong way to implement such features… as u mentioned a prime contentder for a service gone shady/shill
For someone like me who wants to see Lemmy be a place that’s owned by users, run by users, and moderated sensibly, what should I do? I have a problem with supporting the lemmy.ml instance.
Keep using it and support whatever replacement comes by if they fail to find because of the Deb’s shitty behavior
deleted by creator
Lemmy instances are already owned and run by their different instance admins and moderators. Regardless of how you feel about Lemmy.ml, development for Lemmy supports all who use different instances.
The alternatives are doing the dev work yourself, or finding a different platform to use.
There are other options… Lemmy development could stop and plenty of people would keep using it in its current atate. Maybe it’d even continue to grow.
Or maybe the developers quit and another team steps in? Open source projects are never fully tied to a single developer team.
The low server cost doesn’t change anything for me. I’m just a person who won’t donate if any amount goes towards keeping that place running under the current admins.
Then teams can fork it if they want, it’s FOSS. Lemmy is adopted because the devs are competent, and a lot of us came here specifically because there are Communists here.
Yes, I agree. Maybe that will happen, or maybe it won’t.
Experience has shown that when others try, they stumble significantly.
GOOD point
“You have to donate to tankie transphobes to support the Reddit alternative” isn’t a great look though. And nutomic has stated that donations for Lemmy development also go towards supporting the .ml servers. That’s a massive issue with the way funding is handled, no matter how you look at it.
I’ve vocally criticized Nutomic’s transphobia, but I have no issue with them being Communists. Further, I already answered the bit about funding Lemmy.ml, let me copy and paste the relevant section:
Further, as @[email protected] said, the Lemmy.ml costs are very low, it’s the actual life costs that allow development of much-asked for features and maintenance to continue.
The donations pay the devs salaries. Donations pay for their video games, food, etc. What the devs do with their salaries allows them to continue developing Lemmy full time, how they choose to spend their salaries is on them.
lemmy.ml hosting is exclusively paid via Opencollective. All other donation options go directly into developer salaries, so not a single cent goes to lemmy.ml hosting.
www.lemm.ee has been the only place I’ve enjoyed using lemmy
The lemmy.ml instance costs like 30$/month to run. Your donation isn’t going to that; your donation is going to develop Lemmy itself
If they do not treat lemmy.ml server donations separately from lemmy development donations, that is a problem.
I don’t want to block lemmy.ml, it’s not like I hate that instance or anything. But I don’t see why I should finance this server - it’s definitely not just a development server. I would like to finance development of lemmy without that money going into that server.
By donating you are not financing the lemmy.ml server, because that is already long covered with a much lower donation level. Everything above that is exclusively for developer salaries.
That’s not quite how a pool of money works.
Once you fill the gas tank in a motorcycle, you can’t pick which molecules of gas go towards acceleration and which ones go towards idling at a red light.
Just donated via ko-fi!
They need users to test, and let people in to do so. The fact that the people here use the server is a necessary function for getting feedback and results from testing. Plus, the server costs are cheap, it’s the life costs that you would really be supporting.
They can pick a different instance, this is bullshit speak.
Wanna be a dev? Fine. Keep your authoritarian bullshit out of it. The devs for lemmy being known as authoritarians causes new people to avoid lemmy.
They literally created the platform. They can moderate their instance however they like. That’s the point of the platform.
And being “authoritarian” is when you moderate your own server how you see fit, like banning the equivalent of bad faith spamming of My Lai, Tulsa Riot, or the 1985 MOVE Bombing Wikipedia articles and pictures in obvious attempts at anti communism and stirring shit.
What “different instance?” Lemmy.ml has always been the test instance, you can block it if you don’t like dealing with Communists. You’re complaining about an anti-Capitalist, federated platform being developed by Communists, if you want a platform with everyone conforming to your views there are other platforms for you.
Nah
Some fraction of my donation would go towards the $30. Any amount of money going from me to .ml, be it $10 or $.00001, is too much.
I know $30 is “not much”, but the amount doesn’t change my principles.
Your donation isn’t going to that
SCAM!
??? what platform do you think lemmy.world runs?
I thought he was a bot. I was wrong.
You thought Lemmy’s co-founder and main developer is a bot? Lmao
Despite my best efforts I do act like a dumbass at times.
Welcome to the club. And it’s very much not limited only to internet forums.
It happens :p
The internet has made people truly paranoid lol.
We’re currently living in the Grift Age of civilization.
no
You’re correct.
Sent a bit. Thank you for Lemmy
Best of luck raising funds! 👍 Pinned for extra visibility.
Best of luck!
Thanks!
Lemmy default UI should seriously consider a daily donation goal, similar to old Reddit. Implement a backend API to fetch the daily amount needed and the current amount donated, and stick it on the right hand side by all the trending communities. As a stats nerd, this would seriously motivate me to donate more.
And like the Vivaldi browser you can get a permanent badge on your name and avatar picture if you donate. im a sucker for those things. and different color depending the amount donated.
Signal does that too
Donation nags to users were added in a recent update. I think it shows up in a year from the last popup, so about 11 months away
The timing is randomized for each user, but everyone see it within a year after the update. Main problem is that Google and Apple are very strict about donations inside apps, so we cant show it to mobile users.
This just changed with Apple this week and you can now directly list donation options in app btw
Do you have a link with more details? This is what Ive been told:
Wouldn’t be many users, but would having a separate version on F-Droid be a way to be able to reach some of them?
Maybe, but thats up to the individual app developers.
Best of luck with this. Would you guys find it helpful if you had more GH contributors?
Absolutely, lemmy could use so much more dev help.
I wish you wouldn’t use GitHub but an open source forge, though.
You mean more people making pull requests? Of course, code contributions are always welcome.
Thanks for the reminder!
Donated via LiberaPay for 1 year.
Ok so personally I really wouldn’t mind having some non-tracking ads in a banner somewhere to at least support a bit (perhaps on an opt-in system). This’d allow me to support lemmy just a little bit every time I use it.
I can see how that would feel good, but unless they were selling ads directly to friendly companies (and even disregarding the fact that it seems unlikely there would be many/any given their anticapitalist bent), this would make the project almost no money, while annoying users and opening them up to a lot of criticisms and a lot of overhead work building it and keeping that system running. Plus the vast majority of instances would probably not willingly run ads to benefit the devs, either due to not wanting ads or political disagreements with the devs, so it’d be only lemmy.ml and some micro instances. A nominal donation of $1/month from users like you, who may not want to spend much but does want to support in some way, would make them more money than a years worth of browsing
Also at least 99% of Lemmy users run adblockers, so no one would want to advertise in the first place lol.
I think we’d all prefer you just post and spread the community that way.
I gladly doubled my monthly contribution. Thank you so much for working on Lemmy! I had no idea you worked on it full-time. That’s insane! It is the first fediverse software I ever used, and it opened my eyes to a whole other side of the internet I didn’t know existed.
Thanks! Yep its been a lot of years of work to get it to this level, but it still astonishes me that a handful of ppl can best reddit / twitter when we put our minds to it.
Quality over quantity I think. From what I’ve seen, the average Lemmy user is significantly more insightful and respectful than the average across other social media platforms. From the development side, you two are free to focus only on what genuinely improves the user experience, without having to worry about investors or some board forcing you to worsen the user experience because profits.
