Elon Musk also did a Nazi salute on the presidents stage.
I’m fucking sick of people acting like it was something else.
Not just one, but TWO!
Three. The camera wasn’t on him for the third Nazi salute.
Jesus christ 🤦🏻♀️
It’s called a sieg heil. Salute makes it sound respectable.
I mean it is respectful but just to Hitler.
Litmus test of friendship.
Just ask them if that gesture was a nazi salute or not. If they say no, walk away, they aren’t worth being friends with.
The only problem I have is with the whole “foreign backed” language. It’s technically not wrong, but please, as a reminder: It was not simply manipulation from Russia and others, putting Trump into power and creating MAGA. It is a homegrown problem, fascism has been smouldering in the US for a long time, and just as another reminder, it is also glimmering in the EU as well.
The country is “occupied” by its ruling class, and in this case, a specific clique of them benefitting themselves even against other capitalists, but overall, this is much more about class-, than it is about nation-dynamics.
We (the USA) were smoldering fascists prior to WW2. Let’s not kid ourselves.
The human race is a bunch of smouldering fascists. Balkans, Rwanda, Chechnya, Iraq, Indonesia, Sri Lanka, India, and Darfur. Nigeria, Mali, Sudan, and other countries in the Sahel region. Take a look at this list of ethnic cleansings.
World history is rife with people trying to gain power so they can kill all the people who don’t look like them.
The human race is a bunch of smouldering fascists.
capitalism is smouldering fascism. the signs are mostly on the capitalist world (which tbf is most people).
also, humans doing bad things does not necessarily equals fascism.
Okay Karl
i wish, comrade.
We (the USA) were smoldering fascists prior to WW2. Let’s not kid ourselves.
Eh, I actually disagree. The US did a social democratic turn after the Great Depression, I think it was one of the eras where the US was furthest from fascism. It ultimately still created and maintained the conditions of fascist tendencies later on and only very partially did the work analysing their own history of imperialism, but I really dislike overuse of the word fascist, because it blunts the analytical edge. The implicit neoliberal social contract was different than the implicit fascist one (which was different than the more social democratic one solidified under FDR, etc.) - and the system no longer having to wear the mask of humanity has real life consequences and creates its own dynamics.
World history is rife with people trying to gain power so they can kill all the people who don’t look like them.
Indeed, but I think it is a fallacy to use that as an ideological framing of inevitability (unsure if that was your aim here). Ingroup-Outgroup thinking is one of the few things, that I think is indeed fundamental to the human condition, but the way it materialises is dependent on the interaction of that tendency with material and historical conditions. Without colonialism, the specific framing of race, for example, would not have existed in the same way. And universalism as a current within modernity is not just a fluke or illusion, but a proper potential tendency within human behaviour as well, one that relies on cultural and material conditions of its own.
Cynicism is in its own right an ideological distortion, where it leaves analysis and tries to impose its interpretation on reality.
Well you do sound like a pretty smart person. I don’t think I can get on the intellectual playing field with you, but I think there was plenty of Nazi sympathizers prior to World war II in America. Here’s just one example from NPR.
https://www.npr.org/sections/codeswitch/2019/02/20/695941323/when-nazis-took-manhattan
As to ethnic strife and tribal warfare, I’m not saying it’s inevitable, just that it’s the default mode. Sort of like entropy, it asserts itself unless we actively act against it.
Lol DHS is now listed in Wikipedia as a Secret Police Organization 🤣
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_secret_police_organizations
I love these editors, they speak the truth as it is.
Doesn’t sound fair to me. Musk is an oligrach, but he’s also, at least, a nazi transphobe who disowned his own daughter. Donald is, at least again, a convicted felon and rapist who was best friend with the the most notorious pedophile of the past 50 years, and also tried to overthrow the government while being backed by a foreign country. Let get our facts straight.
It’s much worse than this
I too used to believe that Trump is getting some kind of kickback for his helping Russia, and maybe he still is
Until very recently I called Trump Putin’s puppet
After seeing Vlad Vexler’s video
I now understand the depths of Trump’s narcissistic psychopathy
Trump separates people into two categories: People who have value to him and those who do not.
Trump will freely give the US and the west to Putin just because he wants to be in Putin’s good graces because Trump requires validation from him.
To Trump, Putin belongs in the class of people that have value to him.
yes, thats what weve been saying. he just wants to pull a reverse kissinger with russia, so he can hurt china.
i doubt he will succeed, but he will throw all he can at it because he convinced himself capable of it.
We are not of value to Trump.
He does not have the mental capacity to have a conscience.
He does not care if we live or die.
To him, it is not Russia that he is helping, only Putin because he has a compulsive need for validation from him.
Ultimately, it’s not even about Putin. It’s just fulfillment of his personal need for validation, a constant quest for self-gratification through the validation of those he sees as being of value
We are not of value to Trump.
He does not have the mental capacity to have a conscience.
He does not care if we live or die.
This is true of literally every big capitalist and most small capitalists (actually the small capitalists are more likely to be pointlessly cruel, instead of simply not caring). Yall focus on individuals too much to understand the systems at work here.
he is a narcissist, but he also has political goals.
Like all mental health conditions there are grades to its severity
Trump isn’t a run of the mill narcissist, he has acute narcissistic personality disorder.
Any political goal he has isn’t his own. They are only there because he is seeking validation from someone else and is enacting their will to achieve that validation.
i think you are overanalyzing his likely condition. his goals aligns with his chosen allies, i don’t think this is very notable.
And I don’t think you’ve watched the video
I can accept that I am not doing the video justice
i did and i think it makes sense that hes a narcissist, its just that political leaders like him arent doing things by themselves, and they have strategic interests.
theres usually a group of people going back and forth before making these decisions. and i think the video guy is pathologizing his relationship with putin too much in lieau of other factors that might matter more.
also a lot of what his regime in general says is possibly meant to make us angry and confused on purpose. trump’s public persona should be taken with a grain of salt, and is not that relevant in face of the decisions made.
Post outlines quite possibly the worst-case scenario
HappySkullsplitter: it’s actually much worse.
I’m an eternal optimist
You can also just call them all pedophiles because that is also what they are
In the same vein, zionism is a far right philosophy of land theft and murder, and its not anti semitism when you object to it-- zionists are being antisemitic when they hide behind the entire jewish religion to commit their terrorism. Dont be afraid of pushing back on old school terrorism and war crimes. We’re better than that. – Or maybe we have been better than that in the past, and will be again.
Yes, I can’t believe I see dipshits that get angry and scream “antisemitism” even on Lemmy, in response to someone pointing out that massacring innocent civilians because you want their land is genocide. There’s no depth in the view of someone who got their feelings hurt when you pointed out the damage they’re causing.
The big problem I have with Lemmy is that you can’t claim the Palestinians are aspiring genociders, despite their actions and open advocacy for elimination of Jews. It’s a fucked up part of the world that isn’t going to get better in my lifetime. Fuck, religion just sucks.
You’re talking about an entire ethnic group. No, “The Palestinians” are not aspiring genociders.
I agree 100%. All zionists are not aspiring genociders either. Both groups leaders fucking suck though.
Palestinians and Zionists are not analogs. One is an ethnic group, the other is an ideology.
Ah yes, what a valid reason to continue genociding innocent people. I bet you they want to do the same to us! Gee I fucking wonder why they have any hate for the people annihilating them
By all objective measures, HitlerPig us the most prolific traitor in American history, wirse than all other American traitors COMBINED.
And yet, I’ve never heard an elected official or media outlet ever call him a Traitor. Until the left starts tying these traitors to their crimes, and hammers on it every single day, the Dems will NEVER wrest the power from the MAGA Traitors.
HitlerPig is a proven traitor, and anyone who still supports him, is also a traitor, and none of them should be allowed to forget it.
“the left”
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generally doesn’t give a shit about ‘the united states’. we aren’t typically fans. for some reason. being a traitor is typically something we get accused of, and it has become a point of pride for many. we call them nazis though. we’ve been doing it for a while, and being called traitors for it.
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has zero large media outlets. because of the ways how we get murdered when we say stuff too loud.
there is no ‘left media’ in this country. really the whole anglosphere. maybe the closest you can get is a few podcasts. I dunno, if you want specifically americans look up the ‘cool zone media’ people.
All I meant by “the left” was EVERYBODY who is not MAGA.
And we can make them care about being called Traitors when we make it clear that it isn’t hyperbole, it isnt rhetoric, it isnt partisan gamesmanship, it means we think they are true criminal Traitors to America, and will be called to account for their Sedition. The leadership, anyone who is elected, should absolutely be charged for their crimes. So should many street level MAGAs, like the J6 traitors, and anyone who gets violent between now and then. The rest should feel so uncomfortable that they want to leave America, and they can go live in Russia.
Yes, I’m sure you’ll have a not of luck defeating fascism by declaring “having the wrong politics” to be legally treasonous
Some political philosphies need to be destroyed. Nazism is one of them. Germany was able to purge Nazism from their nation, and survive as a productive nation of the world, with the help of the United States and the Nuremburg Trials, and we will have to be courageous enough as a nation to do the same thing.
Ok, but you’re not talking about purging Nazism, you’re talking about arresting your political enemies for “treason”.
MAGA is just re-branded Nazism, they are the exact same thing. MAGA is nothing more than a highly financed criminal enterprise, and should be illegal. They should be treated exactly the same as any violent street gang, or the Mafia.
I do not advocate locking people up for their political affiliations, but they should be locked up for their actual crimes, and the lists of HitlerPig’s crimes, and those of his family and henchmen are long. Planning, leading, promoting, rallying, and launching an Insurrection is a CRIME, and all those involved should be held to account for it. The False Electors Plot was a crime, and all involved should be hrld to account for it. Stealing hundreds of classified documents is a crime, and all those involved should be held to account for it.
There are many more crimes that we all saw with our own eyes, so many that HitlerPig would spend the rest of his life shuttling between his prison cell and courtrooms. That would be fine with me, but it would probably be better for America if he just gets convicted of enough of his crimes to put him away until his death, with no access to any media.
I don’t want anyone to go to prison for their politics, just their crimes. Dont you think criminals should be held accountable for their crimes? If a Democrats stole hundreds of classified documents, would you forgive them and vote for them?
Why are MAGAs so soft on crime?
by ‘the left’ I mean ‘everyone to the left of literal nazis’
so… I don’t even know where to start with all the problems with this. I’m just going to tell you that this is a very bad idea and you need to fucking stop immediately. you’re playing into their hands so hard.
traitors
traitors to what? why the fuck should I care?
it’s not hyperbole
yeah, nobody cares. they were saying that before I was born, during reagan’s attempted genocide of my people. nobody. fucking. cared. nobody has ever cared. nobody will ever care.
americans like to dismiss and not think about problems. it’s kind of their whole deal. ‘hyperbole’ is just an excuse. they don’t actually care whether it is. they care whether they can keep ignoring it. okay, so, they’re traitors. what now? why should the average american give a shit about whatever the fuck that means?
should feel so uncomfortable they want to leave america
oh honey. there’s two ways this ends: the nazis kill us, or we kill them. if they leave, we need to hunt them down. they know this. please catch the fuck up.
I’m not only caught up, I’ve been ahead of the curve for years. I’m a history grad, and I’ve been making the Nazi comparisons for years, because it was clear as day to me that they were following the Nazi playbook. Now it’s finally clear to everyone else, too.
I don’t understand what your issue is. We are actually on the same side, but your are somehow fixated on the word Left. Calm down.
ALL MAGAs are Traitors to America and the Constitution, and they should have that label tattooed on their foreheads.
The constitution has mostly allowed for this to happen unimpeded. We need something new, evidence based and up to date for this absolutely new paradigm we find ourselves in, that meets as many of the needs of every person who lives here as possible.
what’s the fascination with america and the constitution? why do those things matter? what is the emotional impact on the average american? why does anyone care?
the questions aren’t just criticism; I’m genuinely trying to work through a thing with you.
and please, stop calling everyone the left. maybe start calling land-reform democratic socialists ‘the mostly reasonable center right’. americans like to be in the middle. they’re cowards. they don’t actually like conflict they don’t know they’re gonna win.
What are you talking about? The entire thread is about America, and the new regime violating the Constitution. That’s what this thread is about, that’s why the “fascination.”
Americans care about the Constitution because its guided our nation since its founding, and it is considered sacrosanct. The new administration is simply ignoring it, and doing whatever they want, which is far too close to the Nazi playbook for comfort. Not only are Americans upset about it, the entire world should be upset about it.
And again, that focus on the word Left, which I seldom use, and almost didn’t in this case. All I meant by the word Left was anyone who isn’t MAGA, because that’s how MAGA sees the world. If you aren’t MAGA, you are on “The Left.”
There’s a special congressional election near me, and the candidates include a rare non-MAGA candidate. The opposition attack ads are painting him as a “Liberal” and “RINO,” when he is just as conservative as any Republican, he’s just anti-HitlerPig.
I understand that Left means something different in Europe, but this thread is about American politics, so I used the word Left in an American political context. It’s weird that there is so much focus on a single word, instead of my actual message.
HitlerPig
I have to ask, are you literally a child?
It’s weird that there is so much focus on a single word
I guarantee you that American leftists are not going to like the idea of being thrown in jail for treason because they don’t consider the constitution “sacrosanct”.
okay but why is it good rhetoric?
outline why anyone cares. define it so you know why it works, or if you can pick out why it has any value, and refine that into something better. or throw it away because it’s useless.
so. why the constitution? why the ‘traitor’? why should the average american care? you’re not convincing me with rhetoric anything like this; I’m disgusted by it, im never going to be convinced, and I’m already pretty intensely anti fascist.
so, in my view? the constitution is a roll of toilet paper the supreme court has wiped their ass with for a century, and it’s all horrifying. except the second amendment, which is a cum sock for nazis, and the thirteenth amendment, which is an excuse to keep doing slavery.
how does it touch our lives? what is the actual effect? what’s the impact of the betrayal here?
okay. that’s how MAGA sees ‘left’. but they see it that way because it’s productive for their goals to see it that way. stop yielding to them. the way you use language shapes the use of language. be more conscious and careful, because ‘you don’t need to be some radical left anarcho-communist to think this is fucked’; you’re undercutting your own message by calling everyone left of otto skorzeny ‘left’.
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Reminder Trump has arranged for “Illegal” Latino men (Venezuelan to be precise) to be sent to Slave/Rape Camps in El-Salvador
Instead of following protocol to sent them back to Venezuela & The fucking Right-Wing (can we call them Rightists ?) Scum-fucks are jerking off to this disgusting state-sponsored slavery.
“don’t be afraid to speak truth to power … that said we’ll stick with the public identity of anonymous”
What actual proof do you have he’s with Russia?
Maybe we shouldn’t be encouraging another crazy person without some kind of actual proof, this is some pizza gate level of insanity.
Elections aren’t rigged, the bad economy decided Trumps election, blame the first past the post system. We got two years of this and the world won’t end.
This reminds me of my dear old uncle, who died of lung cancer that the doctor told him was just a cough. “Go home, take some Robitussin, it’ll clear up.”
There is so much mental illness in America. You cant reason with them, they are trapped in a full on delusion and that delusion defines who they are. The scary part is that they used to be on the fringes of each party but now they are in the drivers seat and their numbers are growing. I worry for the future of America.
