The difference is Galileo produced a highly successful theory with more explanatory power than its predecessor, while people who don’t trust “The Science” nowadays spent exactly 2 seconds thinking about it before saying “nuh uh”.
I mean, everyone knows were on the back of a turtle, being held up by elephants
The turtle moves!
Nice try.
Everyone knows it’s turtles all the way down.
No. Everything is tuberculosis.
So funny, if atlas hear you will drop the land to the void
The turtle is named the Great A’Tuin, btw
Behold, the Turtle! of enormous GIRTH!
Upon his shell, he holds the EARTH!
(… ya’ll, should we get a community? is there one already?)
There’s [email protected]
But, being on .ml, not everyone has a guarantee of access, since it gets defederated from a few instances. There’s a couple of others, but they’re really not active at all.
I’d suggest literature.cafe, if anyone was to start a new one. Kinda their focus
I see that Adam Connover fan. TBH that guy used to seem cool but he’s spread a lot of information the last few years. The end of College Humour must have broken him.
Completely disagree. His podcasts are stellar. I understand people might not like his monologues, but other than that, bunching him with the “world is flat” people is far-right moronism.
disinformation??? that’s quite a claim, and I’ve seen no one back it up yet
Literally the only thing I can find is an opinion piece about his electric vehicle video.
Notably, Electrek offered discount codes for Teslas around the time the article was published, giving them a massive incentive to lie about Conover’s credibility
I’m curious, what’s the issue you have with him? I’ve only seen him vocal about the writer strikes lately and his message was fine.
He was very critical of the DNC candidates during the election. Saying he wasn’t pro-union and talking about how unfit Biden is for office, etc. He also seemed to be very critical of socialism in the USA. He seems to take a controversial stance on every possible subject, possibly just to promote his podcasts and live shows.
He comes off as one of those people who doesn’t want anybody on the left to win, but he just doesn’t support the right, either.
Biden wasn’t pro-union, and he was unfit for office. Sounds like Conover was absolutely right
I present to you Option B:
We could have had option C
Option C lost the Primary by 10 Million votes in 2020 and didn’t even compete in the 2024 Primary.
Fuck off with your fantasies. You had option A or B.
As of November 3rd 2020, that’s true, and I voted A.
In between elections, we had a chance to get C in the race, and we failed.
As of November 5th 2024, it was actually option D or B, and I voted D.
Maybe if option A had dropped out earlier and let us have a primary, option C would have been in the race. Maybe he would have even won.
Sonce when being critical of DNC == “A lot of disinformation”?
When the GOP adopted anti-intellectualism.
When was he critical of socialism? I saw him once interview a socialist who said socialism in the USA was on life-support. That’s all I could find.
Exactly. His defeatism was criticism. His alarmism was dissuation.
Look, I’m not labelling him the enemy or anything, but I just don’t like the guy.
Personally saying that socialism is half-dead seems like a good description to me. It was also seen as an improvement from being totally dead in that interview. Adam himself is a union guy so he definitely seems not defeatist.
In any case I can understand your position. I personally dislike quite a few people in the movement even if I don’t see them as enemies.
Bernie Sanders is the most popular politician in the United States of America.
A small handful of politicians a mass movement does not make
He’s literally on the board of a union and everything I’ve seen him say is very pro union, I think you may be taking something out of context.
Connover said Biden wasn’t pro-union. I’ll make an edit to use more clear language.
Go watch a clip from when he went on Joe Rogan and dismally failed at supporting and explaining trans issues.
He is a moron who acts like he has the moral high ground by default, but can’t actually formulate an argument.
He’s a smug, overconfident blowhard.
He actually is the stereotype of the privileged, limousine liberal know it all that conservatives paint many of their critics as.
His heart may be in the right place, but his mind isn’t up to the task.
I couldn’t have come up with a better opposite to the truth if I tried
Oh, I really liked “Adam ruins everything”.
Maybe I am in a different environment (particularly not being American), but the old scientists still exist and are still hard at work. In fact, all scientists I know (and I work in academia) care very little for misinformation on their day to day lives. They’ll make fun of it, but don’t have any more contact with them than anyone else. They still spend most of their time working on their actual projects. The only thing that changed is that now they’re bending over backwards to include AI in their grants to make sure they’re accepted, but having to include the latest buzzwords is nothing new.
Science communicators, on the other hand, yeah, those probably have their hands full with fixing misinformation.
I bet they do still consume misinformation, just not in their fields. I know enough scientists that believe in great man theory or that a magic hand fixes the market to know that they’re out there.
all scientists I know (and I work in academia) care very little for misinformation on their day to day lives.
Well in the US, that misinformation “won” and is coming for scientists now. Their funding is no longer a given, especially diverging from orthodoxy. Self-censorship is becoming the norm.
It can happen elsewhere, too. Use us as a warning.
also, please send very well armed help. if you don’t liberate us, america will start invading soon. first it will probably be canada or greenland, but that shit won’t STOP at any point.
in less than a decade
I hate to tell you this, but the Human Genome Project the meme is referencing was completed in 2003 and published in 2004.
Time sure flies 🥲
more than any specific project the meme may be referencing, it’s pointing out the difference between scientific acceptance and derision, which has changed more drastically in the last 10 years than in the last 20.
Science derision, has been around for forever, look up the history of anti-vaccination leagues in the UK and US in response to the small pox vaccine in the 1800s. There were antivax parents at my primary school in the 90s too. They were just in pockets of small communities before, and therefore wielded less power. Social media has allowed them to gather into one town square and allowed them to reinforce each other’s delusions, amplify their voices, spread (aptly) like a virus, and most importantly tie it to a political/culture war.
Or it’s the consequences of lead and heavy metals poisoning finally coming to their natural conclusion regarding the function of the human brain.
unfortunately, your new comment is a further pedantic and unnecessary expansion of both what the meme and my comment succinctly stated; you are apparently still missing the point of memes in general, this meme in particular and my comment: the specifically rapid public shift from science appreciation to scientific derision.
I’m happy you’re finally learning about this, but please make it clear that you have discovered something new for yourself and the reason you are publicly sharing this common knowledge, rather than pretending I asked for you to make a perfectly enjoyable, understandable meme 40 times longer and less clear.
Then let me be succinct: There was never any “science appreciation” among the general public, and if you think there was, you’re in a bubble. A specific, most likely higher educated and most likely American bubble. You’re just hearing voices outside the bubble now.
Condescending comments like your reply might contribute to the science derision though, just saying.
Nah man, this is recency bias, pre internet science was generally well regarded and respected. There is empirical evidence to support this even over just the last 10 years.
“There was never any “science appreciation” among the general public”
you are demonstrably incorrect and your confident ignorance is insulting and harmful in general.
but here I am, being the guardrail to your misinformation again:
less than a decade ago, measles was eradicated from the US.
since then, vaccinations and science in general have been maligned and you can see in national polls that scientific authority is less respected than it was a decade ago to the point that measles has been brought back and is now killing children again.
because in less than a decade, science appreciation has turned into scientific derision.
you are completely wrong here, and you are not helping anything by spreading misinformation and flaunting your ignorance of the matter.
“…comments like your reply might contribute to the science derision though, just saying.”
of course you are “just saying”, that is the problem with your comments: they add no value…
value-added comments are what is needed.
If your comments do not add value, as your three have not in this thread, then they are value-less and should be withheld.
you are adrift.
Measles vaccinations being down can also be linked to mandatory vaccination laws being taken off the books across states during the last decade. It says nothing about the inherent levels of scientific education of the parents doing so.
Previously, parents were mandated by law to have their children vaccinated at birth or to attend schools. We don’t know if they would have opted to vaccinate their kids if it wasn’t mandatory, and it definitely doesn’t point to them “appreciating science” more.
Again, very condescending reply from you, considering correlation /= causation is a basic rule of research.
Enjoy your crashout, ig.
COVID was somehow the visceral turning point. Variations on visitor restrictions in hospitals still exist since then due to the extraordinary and amazing displays of bad behavior from that time.
People could always behave badly. Direct care staff, as one example, have been wearing panic buttons linked directly to security and calling a violence code over the announcement system, since around 2015 on the medical side of things.
But COVID was a severe escalation point. Families screaming in hallways that the diagnoses was “fake news” or part of the hospitals “corporate conspiracy” escalating to the point of pulling medical equipment off their loved ones, who could not breathe without that medical equipment.
Behaviors that could potentially kill people wrapped up in an inexorable belief that science was lying. No trust of medical personnel who are there to help whatever the system around them contrives to do with care.
While the behaviors are not like COVID times any more, there’s a residual skepticism of, well, everything since that time. Sadly, one that is preyed upon by politics to keep us fighting one another instead of punching up.
Forgive me, maybe “punching up” is now a ban-worthy turn of phrase.
I’m in a very conservative state and until recently I worked in hospitals around the country. You would not believe the amount of times I’ve heard covid conspiracy shit from actual healthcare workers. The most common one is that it’s just the flu, but when anyone died for any reason at the time they put down covid as cause of death. Why would anyone do this? I guess it doesn’t have to make sense. Just to hazard a guess I’d say more than half of the people in my state believe some form of covid conspiracy or disinformation.
I used to live in Seattle and while I didn’t work in the medical field… I knew quite a lot of nurses and other, fairly entry level kinds of medical workers.
Most of these people, again, in Seattle, a supposed bastion of lefties… were vaccine skeptics or outright antivax, when COVID happened.
A lot of these people came from the more conservative areas outside Seattle, and then worked in Seattle because it was the only area hiring… but yeah, my anecdotal experience was/is that many medical staff themselves succumbed to vaccine conspiracies, and would freely admit and bitch about masking and vaccines when off the job.
my anecdotal experience was/is that many medical staff themselves succumbed to vaccine conspiracies, and would freely admit and bitch about masking and vaccines when off the job.
Not even just off the job. I worked at a surgery center during the first few years of COVID, and I still distinctly remember at least one surgeon walking around the clinical areas with a mask that read “this mask does nothing”. And in pretty sure he was seeing patients wearing that too.
I am still baffled by that, because this fucking window licker had to have taken microbiology, and literally wore a mask every goddamned times they did the thing they trained for.
I’d be discussing declining the procedure based on that. I don’t know if I’d pull the trigger, based on a number of things: how likely can I get the procedure done elsewhere or by a different surgeon, how badly and quickly do I need the procedure, insurance issues. But I’d certainly try to talk to hospital staff about it.
On the other hand, I’ve heard Herman Cain was an idiot savant. So just because they can’t make change without an automatic register doesn’t mean they can’t do surgery.
Most of the skepticism was rooted in the shorter testing period of the initial mRNA vaccines. We have the data now to prove they’re safe, but that initial fast-tracking spooked people.
If it wasn’t mRNA it would’ve been something else. They gotta have a wedge issue to turn people against each other.
The skepticism was mostly based on propaganda, misinformation, and ignorance.
Maine lost something like a third of its nurses to a vaccine mandate. Which is cute because medical staff, all the way down to janitorial (hi) get updated vaccines every year.
I have heard of and witnessed an incredible amount of cognitive dissonance, horizontal and other ableism, anti-science, anti-masking, anti-vaccine and anti-health behavior and misinformation in my “thank god we live here” blue state, most often by folks who are less marginalized and otherwise less effected by the problems I listed above (but not always) and I don’t necessarily blame these people for being overwhelmed and confused because they’ve been intentionally captured in a disinfo bubble that is the result of being the target of concerted efforts by multiple actors at up to and including the state level to keep them that way for their own purposes, although I do hold them individually responsible for harm they are directly causing as a result, or partially responsible for harm they help to perpetuate that is done by systems or groups which can be massive. The work to undo the programming/socializing needs to start asap on an individual level or if we ever have the chance to make something new it will end up having the same problems. Deconstruction of harmful behaviors and thoughts is necessary, with professionals or loved ones or on ones own, whatever the case, the point is to stop doing the dirty work for corporations and billionaires and anyone else who benefits from these hierarchies by reinforcing the values they want us to have such as obedience to authority and individualism.
This is even more of a specific personal anecdote, but here goes:
My brother is a self described tankie.
Used to live with him.
His entire personality could be described as constantly having a nervous breakdown, and barely masking this with a thin veneer of absurd overconfidence and unchallengable moral superiority.
Just a bubbling cauldron of insecurity.
He spent tons of time following the progression of COVID, and was well informed.
He spent months keeping up with all the updates on vaccine types and availability and different kinds of masks, talking about it all the time.
… Then, after about 9 months of constantly being either having or being on the verge of a nervous breakdown… he managed to convince himself that it would be a great idea to fly to an in person work related convention, in Vegas, during the height of a COVID wave.
He did so, came back with COVID, got me sick, and I lost 2 weeks of work from it.
I was paying more than half the rent, and his finances were way more fucked than he let on, and then proceeded to freak out about that.
… He… knew that even if everyone is wearing masks, it doesn’t work as well when you’re in an enclosed area with a lot of people, and that a convention should be avoided at all costs to minimize exposure risk.
We’d talked about these scenarios in the months prior, in detail.
He knew that I had a bunch of comorbidities at the time for having a way worse time with COVID. Overweight, only recently stopped smoking cigarettes, other chronic health problems.
But nope, it was somehow my fault for causing him stress by … assuming I didn’t have vacation/sick time I could use, assuming I wouldn’t be able to pay my share of the rent…
Not his fault for nearly fucking killing me via COVID, when he knew that was a fairly likely result of his own actions.
… And all of that is even more insane in the context of our shared history, which includes 3 instances where I dropped everything, abandoned commitments to other friends or family, spent a lot of my own money… to save him from being homeless and/or save his life from ODing or carrying through with a very credible suicide attempt.
… I got him the job that he went to the convention for… I got him that job a decade earlier when he was homeless, connected him to some of my friends who worked at the same place and convinced them to convince the owner to pity hire him.
He just stayed there and worked his way up the ranks of a small family business.
Sorry, I’m just having a therapy session for myself at this point, but… jesus fuck, I am so glad I am far away from him.
Forgive me, maybe “punching up” is now a ban-worthy turn of phrase.
This isn’t reddit, you can say whatever you want
Luigi did nothing wrong and neither did the guy who actually fired the gun
It took me way too long and finally zooming in to realize the first dude didn’t strap knives to his face…
Is almost like rampant breeding without any environmental pressures causes a decline in the traits that evolved to deal with those pressures. AKA, Idiocracy has happened because we’re too soft to tell people to stop fucking. “Having babies is a Gawd-given right! You can’t take away muh freedums!” Most people shouldn’t be breeding, the species weeps when ~90% of us give birth.
Your eugenic sentiments aside, if you want people to have fewer babies, you don’t just tell them to stop fucking; you teach them how to use contraception and make it as accessible as possible.
But Idiocracy’s point still stands, the most poorly educated in that scenario will be the ones to reproduce the most.
I don’t think that there’s a compelling argument against population control as the future looms, how it is implemented is what I think is up for debate.
I strongly believe in personal freedom, but in an overpopulated world, I’m not certain that freedom should extend to reproduction.
Here’s where I get a little eugenic-y, and it feels icky, downvote if you must, but I’d prefer an intelligent reply. Why should a species, faced with the problem of overpopulation and gifted the power of sentience, not elevate it’s best and suppresses it’s worst? Maybe because I don’t feel a personal drive to have kids, my partner isn’t interested either, but it feels very selfish to think you personally have the right to add one more unregulated specimen to the petri dish.
Is it a huge turn away from what has made us human since forever? Yea, but wasn’t the Internet? Internal combustion engines? I don’t feel strongly enough about this to not be swayed in my ideas, but I just see it as a logical extension of a problem we face. What would Vulcans do?
people who have access to equitable righta and education (ie girls go to school, everyone has access to the economy and healthcare including sexual health) tend to self-regulate the population towards sustainable levels.
Stupidity is created through systemic sexism, dumbification, and reinforcement of poverty.
Baby booms happen when people don’t know how the world, including their bodies, work, and when uterus-havers are isolated and have control over their own life paths and bodies removed.
the usa before women had equitable banking, voting, education, healthcare, and employment access is a fine example – there are plenty around the world.
tl;dr overpopulation is an effect of discriminatory and oppressive environments and not a herreditary issue.
we are born to a bellcurve of smartness; just a lot of people get it starved and beaten out of them and are put on the prison pipeline before they can figure out what’s going on.
we’ve known this a long time but it’s hard to ‘sell’ to privledged people who didn’t have to think about it and don’t want to talk about reperations for redlining, boarding schools, etc… (good morning and welcome to the Blood Machine)
can anyone write a monster truck ad version of my comment that is readable at a 3rd grade level, pls?
also, it’s the power grip and reciprocity. that’s what makes us human.
It was good information until you decided to be a dick at the end. I was going to thank you for a decent response but actually fuck you for deciding that I need a 3rd grade monster truck ad to understand it. That sort of elitism is a big part of the reason the stupid half of the country fucking hates the educated half.
The monstertruck comercial is for people in my life that I love. Also my own enjoyment.
I don’t think people who crave high stimulation messaging, or enjoy pantomime or slapstick should be left to the mercy of profiteer programming. Just because I enjoy technical reading and essay style lectures doesn’t mean that works for everyone. I wouldn’t like to leave any neighbors behind.
Not sure what works for you, internet stranger, but maybe it isn’t socratic dialogue.
So. Yah, everything from my prior post is earnest and inclusive. Folx can fimd a better place any projected sarcasm or derision.
on tumblr they say some of the reading comprehension is piss poor. (#iheardupissonthepoor)
No one needs to thank me or like me, as long as I can have my equitable living rights, yah? so no sweat: keep the emotional labour.
Why should a species, faced with the problem of overpopulation and gifted the power of sentience, not elevate it’s best and suppresses it’s worst?
For fucks sake dude, literally every time this sentiment comes up someone points it out: who decides who is the best and who is the worst? Your idea of who is worthy of reproducing and who isn’t is just as subjective as any nazi’s. Why should you get to decide whether I can have kids, and who would give you that authority?
That’s a point that we AGREE upon. I feel like me saying it feels icky and acknowledging the awful history of eugenics was just ignored. This isn’t a global famine sized problem yet, but when it is, and this conversation is forced upon us, then what? If you agree that overpopulation is a looming problem, what solution do you propose?
You acknowledged the awful history, and then proceeded to ask why we shouldn’t do it again.
I personally don’t agree that overpopulation is a problem we need to try and solve. If overpopulation kills people, let it. We won’t go extinct. It’s not our place to try and solve a self-correcting problem by deciding whose human rights we should violate.
Great news Mr eugenicist, no more than 60% of the population can give birth.
It’s an awkward example to pick. Human genome research was so controversial someone made an award-winning dystopian sci-fi movie to criticise it.
We did collectively get Maya Hawke out of that deal, though.
Incidentally, that was written by the same guy who made dystopian fiction about reality TV and corporate-sponsored vtubers before either thing existed. Andrew Niccol turned out to be amazing at spotting upcoming trends, terrible at identifying how exactly they would ruin things.
Is that the Andy Ruins Everything guy?
…Adam?
It’s mostly the red hat cult that doesn’t trust science.
What do you have against redhat.com?
Not that red hat cult, the other one. 😂
This one? https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=red+hat+cult
I really don’t get it.
MAGA cult
They shifted to a paid subscription model and fucked over any goodwill they had. Yeah they were major contributors to open source, but we gave them clemency because we didn’t think they’d position themselves to fuck us over so eagerly. Had we known, we wouldn’t have made so many downstream distros from them.
When was RHEL non-sub? I’m guessing you’re thinking of the code availability change, or maybe centos? Or are you literally thinking of the RH and not RHEL?
Yeah they were major contributors to open source
Still are.
Had we known, we wouldn’t have made so many downstream distros from them.
I remember rocky, alma, oracle, and Amazon. 2 of those are now upstream, 2 are still downstream (and only 1 wasn’t corpo backed).
Alternatively they might not have made that change if people weren’t literally repacking their product and trying to steal their market share by giving it away for free with cheaper enterprise support. Imagine telling that to a room of rich shareholders.
You can’t jump on an already successful FOSS product, make large changes to it under an extremely copy-left license free for all to use, and then turn around and claim that people are stealing your lunch.
In the world of business where everyone claims to have bootstrapped their products out of thin air? Sure, use that Looney tunes logic.
I agree with you, but we aren’t corpo assholes. And those changes were allowed under that extremely copy-left license.
Those changes were heartily welcome; no other company that I know of has believed in Linux so strongly and so early on than RedHat. But if they were doing it all for financial reasons, (as any company would, as there was definite money to be made in a Windows alternative for enterprise systems), then either they were blind to the idea that they would empower any future competitors who could fork off their contributions, or deaf to the notion of what FOSS ultimately was and sought to undermine/control it in the long-run.
I’m bitter about RedHat because I wonder now if the second option was the plan all along.
I always think it’s so weird when someone uses the aryan chad guy or whatever it’s called to show the “good old days” or whatever. Additionally in this case I find it curious that the images used for the folks who seem to represent the regressive anti-science crowd are a group of characters with more diverse looks. Care to explain your choices OP? @[email protected]
Not disagreeing with you, but we really need to stop letting “Aryan” mean what the Nazis decided it should mean. Aryan is, and always has been, a term for the Indo-Iranian cultures. As scientists, we need to be the first to take it back to its actual meaning.
Agreed, as an Indo-Aryan person that always made me feel uneasy
Honestly, my opinion as someone of Indian descent is the only people that really care about “reclaiming aryan heritage” from nazis are hindutva “Brahmin piety” type people
I consider myself Indian, not Aryan
That’s just my opinion, I don’t claim to represent all indo Iranians but like honestly in my opinion the nazis can keep the aryan name
“Real” Aryans aren’t even worth being proud of anyways, the Aryans were primarily known for using chariot warfare to subjugate the Indian subcontinent and then spent centuries enforcing and enacting the horrific caste systems.
Nazis can keep the Aryan culture personally I don’t need it anyways
- my own opinions ofc
Ethno nationalism is bad, whether it’s nazi Aryanism or Hindutva Aryanism
Totally fair. As a student of ancient languages, I primarily think of it in terms of language development and archeology, so I can certainly see why its modern connotation would be spurned. I think that, since the term’s misuse came out of the bullshit archeology of Nazi Germany, it’s better to air it out for the bullshit it is.
Consider also that “Semitic” is a philological term for the languages of the varied peoples of the Arabian peninsula and the Levant, so for an Israeli politician to claim that Palestinians are “antisemitic” is hilariously stupid. There are a lot of uses of these old archeological terms and symbols that got corrupted when the Nazis first did their Nazi thing, and my hope is to disempower their rhetoric by contributing to the disempowerment of the bullshit they spawned.
I personally think it’s just hilarious that the term for “white, blonde, and blue-eyed” among racial purists literally refers to a heritage that virtually cannot be further from their supposed “ideal”. It is for this reason that I correct people, because it is just another case of Nazis and White Supremacists showing that not only do they know nothing, they actively look less intelligent with every word they spew. The more people who realize that the Nazis are wrong, the better. In the case of the thread OP to whom I replied, it seemed like an opportunity to pass on this tidbit, because their stance makes me think that they and I are like-minded in our opinion of Nazi idiocy.
Makes sense to me
Thank you for pointing that out, I have changed it to be more accurate.
Dude, I’m sick to death of these undying white supremacy memes. There’s billions of cartoon faces out there, why does everyone have to use the one that’s born out of racism and hate?
Yeah op you’re right, people who hate science are definitely liberals with eyed bright hair
lol not all people with dyed hair are lefties
Just 99%
It’s still the recognized Internet stereotype.
People just aren’t noticing that this is protection.
</s>
Agree with your sarcasm, but Poe’s Law applies. Always close your sarcasm HTML tag.
Eh… a lot of people were protesting “Frankenfood” when the human genome project was going on.
People have always been idiots about science, just that the idiots are more organized and more vocal now.
MSM let them on and gave them a megaphone.
The earth is an island on a turtles back.
